1 00:00:06,619 --> 00:00:03,760 the reason I use my own computer is that 2 00:00:07,990 --> 00:00:06,629 the symbols mathematical symbols get 3 00:00:10,370 --> 00:00:08,000 changed in other people's machines 4 00:00:11,990 --> 00:00:10,380 either because I'm not saving it 5 00:00:13,580 --> 00:00:12,000 properly or it's an older version or a 6 00:00:16,359 --> 00:00:13,590 newer version or something like that and 7 00:00:18,349 --> 00:00:16,369 so I've had little is showing 8 00:00:24,970 --> 00:00:18,359 entanglement I've had little telephones 9 00:00:32,659 --> 00:00:27,470 so we'll see how many telephones we get 10 00:00:35,420 --> 00:00:32,669 today okay what I want to talk about I 11 00:00:36,979 --> 00:00:35,430 just go on a review quickly some of the 12 00:00:39,799 --> 00:00:36,989 things that other people have said and 13 00:00:42,650 --> 00:00:39,809 done looking at the interface of 14 00:00:45,319 --> 00:00:42,660 consciousness and the physical physical 15 00:00:46,630 --> 00:00:45,329 reality through quantum theory and then 16 00:00:50,180 --> 00:00:46,640 I want to say a little bit about 17 00:00:55,369 --> 00:00:50,190 something I thought about down here 18 00:00:59,060 --> 00:00:55,379 looking at well you'll see first of all 19 00:01:01,010 --> 00:00:59,070 here's what's happened with 20 00:01:03,410 --> 00:01:01,020 computationalism I would have thought 21 00:01:04,880 --> 00:01:03,420 that I that the last 40 or 50 years had 22 00:01:06,399 --> 00:01:04,890 demonstrated pretty clearly that there 23 00:01:08,929 --> 00:01:06,409 are aspects of higher mental processes 24 00:01:10,520 --> 00:01:08,939 into which the current armamentarium of 25 00:01:11,719 --> 00:01:10,530 computational models theories and 26 00:01:14,000 --> 00:01:11,729 experimental techniques offers 27 00:01:15,440 --> 00:01:14,010 vanishingly little insight and this is 28 00:01:16,999 --> 00:01:15,450 by someone who started the whole 29 00:01:19,670 --> 00:01:17,009 computation 'lest movement in the first 30 00:01:22,310 --> 00:01:19,680 place and so it seems that maybe 31 00:01:23,770 --> 00:01:22,320 something's going wrong here we're up 32 00:01:26,270 --> 00:01:23,780 against a hard problem of consciousness 33 00:01:30,319 --> 00:01:26,280 how do you get an experience will stream 34 00:01:32,060 --> 00:01:30,329 out of you know the biological equipment 35 00:01:35,090 --> 00:01:32,070 that you have or a computational system 36 00:01:36,920 --> 00:01:35,100 and computational has not solved that 37 00:01:40,819 --> 00:01:36,930 problem nor does it look like it ever 38 00:01:43,130 --> 00:01:40,829 will and so that's one reason for 39 00:01:45,319 --> 00:01:43,140 starting to look at consciousness and 40 00:01:46,760 --> 00:01:45,329 quantum theory another reason is that we 41 00:01:49,370 --> 00:01:46,770 need to adequately take into account 42 00:01:50,960 --> 00:01:49,380 data concerning anomalous phenomena such 43 00:01:53,179 --> 00:01:50,970 as the sort of things that we've looked 44 00:01:54,590 --> 00:01:53,189 at here and so maybe we're looking at 45 00:01:57,679 --> 00:01:54,600 the wrong level and bernie already 46 00:01:58,760 --> 00:01:57,689 talked about this it's not the neural 47 00:02:00,260 --> 00:01:58,770 activity that gives rise to 48 00:02:02,660 --> 00:02:00,270 consciousness maybe we need to look 49 00:02:04,910 --> 00:02:02,670 somewhere else or consciousness and so 50 00:02:08,719 --> 00:02:04,920 one place to pick is at the subatomic 51 00:02:12,649 --> 00:02:08,729 level and so we're looking at quantum 52 00:02:16,229 --> 00:02:12,659 theory Ian Marshall 53 00:02:18,780 --> 00:02:16,239 psychiatrist his wife is a physicist 54 00:02:22,020 --> 00:02:18,790 actually they do the inverse she writes 55 00:02:26,459 --> 00:02:22,030 about psychiatric things he writes about 56 00:02:27,959 --> 00:02:26,469 physics things and he proposed that the 57 00:02:30,390 --> 00:02:27,969 ground state of a bose-einstein 58 00:02:32,009 --> 00:02:30,400 condensate could be the basis for an 59 00:02:34,110 --> 00:02:32,019 alert content list state of 60 00:02:35,759 --> 00:02:34,120 consciousness and that excitations of 61 00:02:38,509 --> 00:02:35,769 that ground state could be experienced 62 00:02:41,910 --> 00:02:38,519 as conscious phenomenon bose-einstein 63 00:02:45,089 --> 00:02:41,920 condensates typically such as rubidium 64 00:02:49,050 --> 00:02:45,099 gas occur at low temperatures and the 65 00:02:51,149 --> 00:02:49,060 brain is warm but said Herbert Ehrlich 66 00:02:53,729 --> 00:02:51,159 if you apply sufficient energy to an 67 00:02:57,179 --> 00:02:53,739 appropriate biological system then you 68 00:02:59,069 --> 00:02:57,189 can get greater coherence in that system 69 00:03:01,830 --> 00:02:59,079 and so you're seeing quantum effects in 70 00:03:05,729 --> 00:03:01,840 biological organisms and according to 71 00:03:06,959 --> 00:03:05,739 Marshall it could be these furyk sort of 72 00:03:08,819 --> 00:03:06,969 version of bones and I sound like 73 00:03:11,190 --> 00:03:08,829 condensates that are going on in the 74 00:03:15,209 --> 00:03:11,200 brain and they give rise to our 75 00:03:17,939 --> 00:03:15,219 experience something similar was 76 00:03:21,240 --> 00:03:17,949 proposed by Mary G Bell and Kunio Yasui 77 00:03:22,979 --> 00:03:21,250 that what you've got is protein 78 00:03:26,610 --> 00:03:22,989 surrounded by water they call these 79 00:03:27,899 --> 00:03:26,620 quarter cones they form a system and of 80 00:03:30,030 --> 00:03:27,909 course we've talked about water here 81 00:03:31,500 --> 00:03:30,040 ordered water there's a lot of water in 82 00:03:34,319 --> 00:03:31,510 the brain it could be ordered that could 83 00:03:35,429 --> 00:03:34,329 be what retains memory and then they've 84 00:03:39,569 --> 00:03:35,439 got these mechanisms for getting 85 00:03:41,610 --> 00:03:39,579 information in and out of it the main 86 00:03:43,559 --> 00:03:41,620 place where consciousness has been 87 00:03:45,869 --> 00:03:43,569 proposed as sort of an active ingredient 88 00:03:49,439 --> 00:03:45,879 in quantum theories is is what Bernie 89 00:03:51,899 --> 00:03:49,449 was talking about and that is that maybe 90 00:03:54,749 --> 00:03:51,909 it's not that consciousness somehow can 91 00:03:57,379 --> 00:03:54,759 be characterized as these fields or 92 00:03:59,849 --> 00:03:57,389 quantum events but maybe maybe it's a 93 00:04:01,439 --> 00:03:59,859 valve on using von neumann's terms the 94 00:04:04,710 --> 00:04:01,449 abstract eagle maybe it's somewhere 95 00:04:06,599 --> 00:04:04,720 beyond the physical realm and this world 96 00:04:07,890 --> 00:04:06,609 is in a state of superposition until we 97 00:04:09,629 --> 00:04:07,900 observe it when we observe it it 98 00:04:10,520 --> 00:04:09,639 collapses into a single experience 99 00:04:15,059 --> 00:04:10,530 reality 100 00:04:16,949 --> 00:04:15,069 here's eugene wigner same Asst quotation 101 00:04:18,270 --> 00:04:16,959 the reduction of the wave packet takes 102 00:04:20,069 --> 00:04:18,280 place whenever the result of an 103 00:04:21,750 --> 00:04:20,079 observation enters the consciousness of 104 00:04:24,089 --> 00:04:21,760 the observer or to be even more 105 00:04:25,690 --> 00:04:24,099 painfully precise my own consciousness 106 00:04:27,580 --> 00:04:25,700 since I am the only of 107 00:04:32,550 --> 00:04:27,590 over all other people being only 108 00:04:35,140 --> 00:04:32,560 subjects of my observations or maybe not 109 00:04:35,590 --> 00:04:35,150 we ignore himself eventually change his 110 00:04:40,470 --> 00:04:35,600 mind 111 00:04:43,870 --> 00:04:40,480 and in the last 5 10 maybe 15 years 112 00:04:45,790 --> 00:04:43,880 decoherence has been proposed as a as an 113 00:04:49,770 --> 00:04:45,800 alternate explanation for having to 114 00:04:53,770 --> 00:04:49,780 resolve the measurement problem and that 115 00:04:55,990 --> 00:04:53,780 argument is actually fairly messy and so 116 00:04:57,670 --> 00:04:56,000 the this idea that consciousness somehow 117 00:05:02,290 --> 00:04:57,680 collapsing a state vector isn't quite as 118 00:05:06,100 --> 00:05:02,300 compelling as it once was however we 119 00:05:08,200 --> 00:05:06,110 have the coke inspector theorem and so 120 00:05:11,110 --> 00:05:08,210 the problem contextuality remains and 121 00:05:13,330 --> 00:05:11,120 what that means is that observables have 122 00:05:14,680 --> 00:05:13,340 no definite values until the set of 123 00:05:17,650 --> 00:05:14,690 observables to be measured has been 124 00:05:19,570 --> 00:05:17,660 chosen so there are no particles out 125 00:05:20,530 --> 00:05:19,580 there they don't have specific values 126 00:05:22,030 --> 00:05:20,540 and so on and so forth 127 00:05:23,380 --> 00:05:22,040 until you actually choose what it is 128 00:05:25,960 --> 00:05:23,390 that you're going to measure and then at 129 00:05:28,540 --> 00:05:25,970 some point following that that can 130 00:05:30,190 --> 00:05:28,550 happen that's actually the name of the 131 00:05:34,480 --> 00:05:30,200 theorem watched pot never boils 132 00:05:36,400 --> 00:05:34,490 and for Henry stop he walked right 133 00:05:37,960 --> 00:05:36,410 through this door and he said well that 134 00:05:41,230 --> 00:05:37,970 that's exactly what's happening he said 135 00:05:43,690 --> 00:05:41,240 that's where that's what we do we select 136 00:05:45,250 --> 00:05:43,700 and then after the selection nature 137 00:05:48,460 --> 00:05:45,260 causes the collapse he thinks there is a 138 00:05:52,990 --> 00:05:48,470 collapse and in fact he he appeals to 139 00:05:54,580 --> 00:05:53,000 the quantum Zeno effect if you looked at 140 00:05:57,340 --> 00:05:54,590 something and then you look at it again 141 00:05:58,870 --> 00:05:57,350 very quickly it's not go like lis to 142 00:06:00,820 --> 00:05:58,880 change it's going to stay in the state 143 00:06:03,010 --> 00:06:00,830 that it was already in he thinks that 144 00:06:05,620 --> 00:06:03,020 mental effort increases the rapidity 145 00:06:09,010 --> 00:06:05,630 with which selections are made and hence 146 00:06:12,160 --> 00:06:09,020 you get this template for action in the 147 00:06:16,030 --> 00:06:12,170 brain and that's how we get to get the 148 00:06:17,710 --> 00:06:16,040 mind to affect the physical system now 149 00:06:19,870 --> 00:06:17,720 it's very important when you start 150 00:06:21,850 --> 00:06:19,880 talking like this to distinguish between 151 00:06:24,010 --> 00:06:21,860 consciousness is the awareness it's the 152 00:06:25,840 --> 00:06:24,020 experiential stream and the volitional 153 00:06:29,920 --> 00:06:25,850 aspects of consciousness like what is it 154 00:06:31,030 --> 00:06:29,930 that makes things happen and and so Evan 155 00:06:33,100 --> 00:06:31,040 Harris Walker has made those 156 00:06:35,340 --> 00:06:33,110 distinctions Amit Goswami and I've 157 00:06:37,390 --> 00:06:35,350 written about that in the past as well 158 00:06:39,370 --> 00:06:37,400 so now that we're okay so we got 159 00:06:41,860 --> 00:06:39,380 volition volition whatever that may be 160 00:06:43,000 --> 00:06:41,870 and wherever that may be as an aspect of 161 00:06:45,880 --> 00:06:43,010 consciousness maybe some deep 162 00:06:48,370 --> 00:06:45,890 consciousness so Jeanne burns is 163 00:06:50,680 --> 00:06:48,380 proposed that you get mental influence 164 00:06:52,990 --> 00:06:50,690 through quantum fluctuations of a 165 00:06:54,730 --> 00:06:53,000 particles momentum so particle will have 166 00:06:57,220 --> 00:06:54,740 quantum fluctuations and its momentum 167 00:06:59,410 --> 00:06:57,230 and she's calculating need for thousand 168 00:07:01,710 --> 00:06:59,420 molecules to be affected in order to 169 00:07:04,210 --> 00:07:01,720 produce a change in the action potential 170 00:07:06,720 --> 00:07:04,220 causing bodily sensation of course she'd 171 00:07:12,240 --> 00:07:06,730 like she also extends that than to 172 00:07:15,310 --> 00:07:12,250 psychokinetic effects what I think see I 173 00:07:17,320 --> 00:07:15,320 think that what I'm looking for here is 174 00:07:18,910 --> 00:07:17,330 I'm looking for a deep connection a deep 175 00:07:21,550 --> 00:07:18,920 connection between consciousness and 176 00:07:24,640 --> 00:07:21,560 physical reality and and looking forward 177 00:07:26,890 --> 00:07:24,650 in the context of quantum theory and so 178 00:07:30,010 --> 00:07:26,900 that's the idea here I think there's 179 00:07:32,580 --> 00:07:30,020 something to this perhaps some aspects 180 00:07:36,870 --> 00:07:32,590 of consciousness are modeled with these 181 00:07:41,110 --> 00:07:36,880 condensates volitional aspects could be 182 00:07:45,750 --> 00:07:41,120 selecting things and they could play a 183 00:07:49,270 --> 00:07:45,760 role in ordering physical reality and so 184 00:07:52,770 --> 00:07:49,280 let me just step up to quantum field 185 00:07:55,600 --> 00:07:52,780 theory which is the basis for the 186 00:07:56,980 --> 00:07:55,610 contemporary standard model but let me 187 00:07:58,450 --> 00:07:56,990 look at the klein-gordon field the 188 00:08:01,120 --> 00:07:58,460 scalar field and i thought there are 189 00:08:03,880 --> 00:08:01,130 four ways that you could possibly get 190 00:08:05,200 --> 00:08:03,890 stick consciousness in here one is they 191 00:08:07,450 --> 00:08:05,210 could modulate the activity of the 192 00:08:08,890 --> 00:08:07,460 conjugate field through parametric 193 00:08:11,080 --> 00:08:08,900 resonance you could change the frequency 194 00:08:12,580 --> 00:08:11,090 and this is Courtney brown alluded to 195 00:08:15,670 --> 00:08:12,590 the idea of changing frequencies last 196 00:08:17,770 --> 00:08:15,680 night it could act as a separate field 197 00:08:19,920 --> 00:08:17,780 interacting with the scalar field or it 198 00:08:22,690 --> 00:08:19,930 could affect the quantum fluctuations of 199 00:08:25,090 --> 00:08:22,700 the field let's look at the last of 200 00:08:26,590 --> 00:08:25,100 those after second quantization the 201 00:08:28,270 --> 00:08:26,600 scalar field the equation looks like 202 00:08:29,920 --> 00:08:28,280 this the klein-gordon equation where the 203 00:08:32,380 --> 00:08:29,930 Dalembert scene is just given by this as 204 00:08:35,640 --> 00:08:32,390 you can see it's just a second 205 00:08:39,820 --> 00:08:35,650 derivative with some junk attached and 206 00:08:44,500 --> 00:08:39,830 there's the there's your conjugate field 207 00:08:45,670 --> 00:08:44,510 PI or again with some fudge factors in 208 00:08:48,190 --> 00:08:45,680 front of the first derivative of the 209 00:08:51,040 --> 00:08:48,200 field itself and here are the solutions 210 00:08:53,230 --> 00:08:51,050 okay what the sort of the form of the 211 00:08:57,670 --> 00:08:53,240 solutions where you get 212 00:08:59,860 --> 00:08:57,680 these mode functions and in addition to 213 00:09:03,280 --> 00:08:59,870 the mode functions you have annihilation 214 00:09:06,190 --> 00:09:03,290 and creation operators as as being part 215 00:09:07,960 --> 00:09:06,200 of the solution and so let's look at the 216 00:09:09,340 --> 00:09:07,970 Freedman robertson-walker space-time as 217 00:09:14,590 --> 00:09:09,350 Bernie said the universe is slowly 218 00:09:20,040 --> 00:09:14,600 expanding right now and if you look at 219 00:09:22,389 --> 00:09:20,050 the if let's choose a fog basis that is 220 00:09:25,990 --> 00:09:22,399 that that will work for us and in 221 00:09:28,570 --> 00:09:26,000 particular you take the annihilation 222 00:09:32,380 --> 00:09:28,580 operator and you define the basis the 223 00:09:36,040 --> 00:09:32,390 lowest energy state of your or the 224 00:09:38,260 --> 00:09:36,050 lowest the zero vector of your fog basis 225 00:09:40,600 --> 00:09:38,270 is defined by annihilating it and 226 00:09:42,790 --> 00:09:40,610 getting a zero vector once you build 227 00:09:44,530 --> 00:09:42,800 that up but build that structure up you 228 00:09:46,389 --> 00:09:44,540 can calculate the fluctuations then this 229 00:09:49,000 --> 00:09:46,399 is just a standard way in which you do 230 00:09:51,100 --> 00:09:49,010 that in quantum theory and when you 231 00:09:55,269 --> 00:09:51,110 after a little bit of arithmetic this is 232 00:09:56,800 --> 00:09:55,279 what you get and basically the point 233 00:09:59,490 --> 00:09:56,810 here is just that it's not zero so 234 00:10:02,230 --> 00:09:59,500 you've got these fluctuations and so 235 00:10:04,480 --> 00:10:02,240 what I what I think could be happening 236 00:10:06,819 --> 00:10:04,490 just as Burns proposed that volition can 237 00:10:08,340 --> 00:10:06,829 affect the momentum fluctuations of a 238 00:10:10,600 --> 00:10:08,350 moving particle let's suppose that 239 00:10:13,510 --> 00:10:10,610 volition effects the fluctuations is a 240 00:10:15,819 --> 00:10:13,520 scalar field and hence if you recall 241 00:10:17,319 --> 00:10:15,829 you're going to be affecting you're 242 00:10:20,050 --> 00:10:17,329 going to be affecting the creation and 243 00:10:22,000 --> 00:10:20,060 annihilation operators those in turn 244 00:10:24,250 --> 00:10:22,010 change the number of particles that are 245 00:10:26,920 --> 00:10:24,260 present and hence among other time other 246 00:10:28,870 --> 00:10:26,930 things space-time curvature so like if 247 00:10:31,120 --> 00:10:28,880 you sort of think about this it's like 248 00:10:34,870 --> 00:10:31,130 as you think and as things are going on 249 00:10:36,370 --> 00:10:34,880 mentally you're affecting the creation 250 00:10:37,810 --> 00:10:36,380 and annihilation operators so particles 251 00:10:39,579 --> 00:10:37,820 are being created and destroyed and so 252 00:10:43,540 --> 00:10:39,589 on and so forth all around you in the 253 00:10:46,510 --> 00:10:43,550 field and and those are changing the 254 00:10:49,120 --> 00:10:46,520 curvature of space-time and all the junk 255 00:10:51,010 --> 00:10:49,130 that's in there like that's related to 256 00:10:52,990 --> 00:10:51,020 all the other fields and so in some 257 00:10:55,600 --> 00:10:53,000 sense you're constantly jiggling 258 00:10:58,269 --> 00:10:55,610 physical reality as you think and as you 259 00:11:00,069 --> 00:10:58,279 as you do things okay now just a small 260 00:11:02,710 --> 00:11:00,079 caveat here of course for the scalar 261 00:11:05,170 --> 00:11:02,720 field the particles are in photons and 262 00:11:08,350 --> 00:11:05,180 they haven't been found but that's the 263 00:11:11,150 --> 00:11:08,360 nature of physics today 264 00:11:13,880 --> 00:11:11,160 following Marshall suppose that alert 265 00:11:15,800 --> 00:11:13,890 consciousness is a klein-gordon vacuum 266 00:11:18,560 --> 00:11:15,810 state with experiencial contents being 267 00:11:20,510 --> 00:11:18,570 the state vectors dafaq space in keeping 268 00:11:22,430 --> 00:11:20,520 with this stratification idea proposed 269 00:11:24,590 --> 00:11:22,440 by Walker in parallel with burns 270 00:11:26,330 --> 00:11:24,600 abolitionist exercise on the operators 271 00:11:28,700 --> 00:11:26,340 on that is to say in this case on the 272 00:11:30,590 --> 00:11:28,710 fields within the scope of uncertainty 273 00:11:32,210 --> 00:11:30,600 this could also be the mechanism of 274 00:11:34,880 --> 00:11:32,220 attention for the selection of operators 275 00:11:36,880 --> 00:11:34,890 proposed as proposed by staff so I 276 00:11:39,800 --> 00:11:36,890 managed to get everything into one 277 00:11:41,090 --> 00:11:39,810 synthesis here so in the end I think 278 00:11:43,150 --> 00:11:41,100 there's an intimate connection between 279 00:11:44,840 --> 00:11:43,160 consciousness and physical manifestation 280 00:11:46,910 --> 00:11:44,850 aligning consciousness with the 281 00:11:48,340 --> 00:11:46,920 klein-gordon feels possible way in which 282 00:11:50,420 --> 00:11:48,350 that connection could occur 283 00:11:52,400 --> 00:11:50,430 consciousness needs to be properly taken 284 00:11:53,840 --> 00:11:52,410 into account at any physical Theory if 285 00:11:56,540 --> 00:11:53,850 we are to have a physical theory that 286 00:12:00,710 --> 00:11:56,550 works that theory will take us beyond 287 00:12:02,390 --> 00:12:00,720 quantum theory as we know it today and I 288 00:12:07,880 --> 00:12:02,400 see that I actually have more time than 289 00:12:09,770 --> 00:12:07,890 I expected oh I love this quote just 290 00:12:10,730 --> 00:12:09,780 this is just a reflection on what I've 291 00:12:12,410 --> 00:12:10,740 just been telling you the very 292 00:12:14,320 --> 00:12:12,420 possibility reflecting on a hypothetical 293 00:12:16,790 --> 00:12:14,330 irreducible field of consciousness 294 00:12:18,590 --> 00:12:16,800 uncovers an inspiring temptation to 295 00:12:20,210 --> 00:12:18,600 escape from the rigid chains of physical 296 00:12:22,340 --> 00:12:20,220 postulates an enter into ultimate 297 00:12:23,990 --> 00:12:22,350 creative capacity this may lead to an 298 00:12:25,820 --> 00:12:24,000 inclination toward relaxed mental 299 00:12:28,070 --> 00:12:25,830 discipline and degraded responsibilities 300 00:12:29,750 --> 00:12:28,080 as a result corresponding approaches can 301 00:12:33,710 --> 00:12:29,760 easily degenerate into purely Belet 302 00:12:36,020 --> 00:12:33,720 ristic expression I love that and I hope 303 00:12:37,670 --> 00:12:36,030 I was doing that because just before I 304 00:12:39,020 --> 00:12:37,680 laughed a lot of mere tastic came and 305 00:12:41,150 --> 00:12:39,030 gave a talk at our universities a 306 00:12:44,660 --> 00:12:41,160 mathematician who says that mathematics 307 00:12:47,210 --> 00:12:44,670 is fiction but that's okay and first of 308 00:12:49,220 --> 00:12:47,220 all I would like to acknowledge all the 309 00:12:51,740 --> 00:12:49,230 mathematicians who have have and 310 00:12:53,920 --> 00:12:51,750 continue to spend hours and hours of 311 00:12:56,300 --> 00:12:53,930 their time explaining this stuff to me 312 00:12:58,370 --> 00:12:56,310 they don't know any but they don't know 313 00:13:00,260 --> 00:12:58,380 there's consciousness stuff they I don't 314 00:13:03,380 --> 00:13:00,270 tell them that I that's I mean they know 315 00:13:04,520 --> 00:13:03,390 I do that but you know and then if 316 00:13:06,680 --> 00:13:04,530 you're interested here are some papers 317 00:13:08,690 --> 00:13:06,690 the best way to get hold of them email 318 00:13:11,330 --> 00:13:08,700 me I realize I didn't put my email up 319 00:13:20,710 --> 00:13:11,340 there but you can see me and I will mail 320 00:13:24,470 --> 00:13:23,090 what is the sound of one hand clapping 321 00:13:27,310 --> 00:13:24,480 when you're carrying a microphone we 322 00:13:38,329 --> 00:13:27,320 have a few minutes for questions here so 323 00:13:43,880 --> 00:13:38,339 okay in this presentation you basically 324 00:13:46,100 --> 00:13:43,890 presume an attentional awareness that 325 00:13:50,570 --> 00:13:46,110 exists at the core of consciousness 326 00:13:52,600 --> 00:13:50,580 which it does but you don't you I don't 327 00:13:55,340 --> 00:13:52,610 think there is a way for this 328 00:13:57,470 --> 00:13:55,350 explanatory scheme or this type of 329 00:14:00,970 --> 00:13:57,480 scheme to explain the essence of 330 00:14:04,970 --> 00:14:00,980 consciousness which is the volitional 331 00:14:07,670 --> 00:14:04,980 awareness core that is seems to me that 332 00:14:12,310 --> 00:14:07,680 it's fundamentally beyond such 333 00:14:16,639 --> 00:14:12,320 explanations any comment I agree 334 00:14:19,070 --> 00:14:16,649 no I'm serious I mean I okay okay they 335 00:14:20,840 --> 00:14:19,080 what I'm trying to do here is to try to 336 00:14:22,340 --> 00:14:20,850 see like I'm trying to feel my way into 337 00:14:24,829 --> 00:14:22,350 this okay so I'm trying to see like 338 00:14:25,850 --> 00:14:24,839 where are they were can we connect them 339 00:14:27,740 --> 00:14:25,860 like where are they coming together 340 00:14:29,960 --> 00:14:27,750 without really being able to understand 341 00:14:32,569 --> 00:14:29,970 exactly what that aspect I call that 342 00:14:34,910 --> 00:14:32,579 deep consciousness in other places and 343 00:14:37,610 --> 00:14:34,920 those of you familiar with David Bohm's 344 00:14:40,850 --> 00:14:37,620 idea of an implicit order I don't like 345 00:14:42,319 --> 00:14:40,860 his the the the mechanics of his theory 346 00:14:44,360 --> 00:14:42,329 but I like the idea of the implicit 347 00:14:46,280 --> 00:14:44,370 order that there's this this domain and 348 00:14:47,780 --> 00:14:46,290 this goes along I think with what 349 00:14:49,819 --> 00:14:47,790 Bernie's saying to you like there's this 350 00:14:51,680 --> 00:14:49,829 domain from which things originate and 351 00:14:54,230 --> 00:14:51,690 sort of our experience all awareness 352 00:14:55,730 --> 00:14:54,240 shows up as one sort of version of that 353 00:14:57,620 --> 00:14:55,740 and physical world shows up as another 354 00:14:59,720 --> 00:14:57,630 but somewhere deep inside they're linked 355 00:15:02,690 --> 00:14:59,730 together and so I agree with you I don't 356 00:15:04,639 --> 00:15:02,700 know what that volitional aspect is but 357 00:15:05,900 --> 00:15:04,649 I think it's somewhere in that deep what 358 00:15:09,500 --> 00:15:05,910 I call the deep consciousness or the 359 00:15:11,960 --> 00:15:09,510 implicit order Stephen Hall is the 360 00:15:14,660 --> 00:15:11,970 assumption on your part that only human 361 00:15:16,910 --> 00:15:14,670 consciousness shapes reality or what 362 00:15:19,069 --> 00:15:16,920 about lower levels like a chimpanzee or 363 00:15:20,930 --> 00:15:19,079 even lower than that no I'm a Pan 364 00:15:23,180 --> 00:15:20,940 psychist I think that there's all kinds 365 00:15:24,890 --> 00:15:23,190 of there are all kinds of mental 366 00:15:28,519 --> 00:15:24,900 influences and mental effects that are 367 00:15:29,720 --> 00:15:28,529 in addition to ourselves I'm trying to 368 00:15:31,930 --> 00:15:29,730 bring the mic to people in 369 00:15:37,939 --> 00:15:31,940 order in which they've caught my eye 370 00:15:40,540 --> 00:15:37,949 hello Richard man when people talk about 371 00:15:42,710 --> 00:15:40,550 the intelligence of the universe or 372 00:15:45,590 --> 00:15:42,720 sometimes ask what I think is a nicer 373 00:15:47,050 --> 00:15:45,600 question is the universe benign it seems 374 00:15:49,400 --> 00:15:47,060 that they're implying that there's a 375 00:15:51,710 --> 00:15:49,410 some kind of operator or some kind of 376 00:15:54,170 --> 00:15:51,720 preference there are many possibilities 377 00:15:57,410 --> 00:15:54,180 that could occur but there's a built-in 378 00:15:59,090 --> 00:15:57,420 tilt to the universe as it were so that 379 00:16:01,579 --> 00:15:59,100 you other things being equal which they 380 00:16:04,670 --> 00:16:01,589 never are but lots of things happening 381 00:16:07,009 --> 00:16:04,680 there's a there's a tendency for certain 382 00:16:09,290 --> 00:16:07,019 things to occur more than others and we 383 00:16:11,629 --> 00:16:09,300 could give a quality to that tendency we 384 00:16:14,840 --> 00:16:11,639 could say it looks intelligent or we 385 00:16:16,310 --> 00:16:14,850 could say it looks benign but we 386 00:16:18,740 --> 00:16:16,320 wouldn't necessarily have to say that 387 00:16:20,300 --> 00:16:18,750 there was an intention that certain 388 00:16:22,670 --> 00:16:20,310 things happen or that there that there 389 00:16:25,189 --> 00:16:22,680 be a willpower will of our listen in 390 00:16:27,650 --> 00:16:25,199 this if that built-in tendency of the 391 00:16:29,480 --> 00:16:27,660 universe is of a certain order and we 392 00:16:34,730 --> 00:16:29,490 wouldn't need to wonder how these 393 00:16:37,309 --> 00:16:34,740 intentions more fruit I agree with you I 394 00:16:40,100 --> 00:16:37,319 I think the volition and it is on top of 395 00:16:42,530 --> 00:16:40,110 that and it basically comes to this 396 00:16:45,769 --> 00:16:42,540 question of is there freewill and I 397 00:16:49,040 --> 00:16:45,779 think there I mean again I mean no one 398 00:16:50,990 --> 00:16:49,050 has a definitive answer or people who 399 00:16:53,660 --> 00:16:51,000 think they do I'm not sure they do but I 400 00:16:56,329 --> 00:16:53,670 think there really is freewill and that 401 00:16:58,280 --> 00:16:56,339 that's one way and which volition enters 402 00:16:59,960 --> 00:16:58,290 in now now we have to be a little bit 403 00:17:01,910 --> 00:16:59,970 careful here and this this goes like to 404 00:17:04,309 --> 00:17:01,920 the m5 theory of Bob John and Brenda 405 00:17:06,230 --> 00:17:04,319 done to that that I mean the if you 406 00:17:08,179 --> 00:17:06,240 intend something at this level it has to 407 00:17:09,890 --> 00:17:08,189 back up to another level or go down to a 408 00:17:11,600 --> 00:17:09,900 deeper level for it to actually make 409 00:17:13,569 --> 00:17:11,610 that kind of direct connection into 410 00:17:15,770 --> 00:17:13,579 physical reality 411 00:17:19,309 --> 00:17:15,780 yeah Gary Schwartz wonderful 412 00:17:21,409 --> 00:17:19,319 presentation to a follow-up I guess to 413 00:17:24,770 --> 00:17:21,419 the previous question where in your 414 00:17:27,770 --> 00:17:24,780 current thinking does the concept of 415 00:17:29,390 --> 00:17:27,780 intelligence come in here his 416 00:17:33,890 --> 00:17:29,400 intelligence something that's derived 417 00:17:36,680 --> 00:17:33,900 from consciousness are they two sides of 418 00:17:38,720 --> 00:17:36,690 the same coin his intelligence that 419 00:17:41,790 --> 00:17:38,730 which creates consciousness where does 420 00:17:46,350 --> 00:17:44,190 I think that there's a there's a just as 421 00:17:47,850 --> 00:17:46,360 with consciousness itself and what we 422 00:17:48,990 --> 00:17:47,860 mean by the word conscious there's a 423 00:17:52,110 --> 00:17:49,000 continuum of what we mean by 424 00:17:53,970 --> 00:17:52,120 intelligence so the very basic sort of 425 00:17:56,340 --> 00:17:53,980 computational acts can be regarded as 426 00:17:57,600 --> 00:17:56,350 being intelligent at one level that's 427 00:17:59,160 --> 00:17:57,610 probably not what you're interested 428 00:18:00,240 --> 00:17:59,170 that's not probably the type of 429 00:18:02,040 --> 00:18:00,250 intelligence you're interested in 430 00:18:04,260 --> 00:18:02,050 talking about so I think as you move 431 00:18:09,540 --> 00:18:04,270 away from that to more creative acts and 432 00:18:11,820 --> 00:18:09,550 to more fundamental or more or value 433 00:18:14,040 --> 00:18:11,830 tively deeper more meaningful acts I 434 00:18:15,660 --> 00:18:14,050 think that you're talking about another 435 00:18:16,860 --> 00:18:15,670 type of intelligence and I think that 436 00:18:19,560 --> 00:18:16,870 that's the intelligence who's hiding 437 00:18:22,200 --> 00:18:19,570 underneath underneath these quantum 438 00:18:24,000 --> 00:18:22,210 fields and that's that's that somehow 439 00:18:26,070 --> 00:18:24,010 I'm I'm sort of looking at its 440 00:18:29,100 --> 00:18:26,080 breakthrough point in a way if you if 441 00:18:31,580 --> 00:18:29,110 you want to think of it that way David 442 00:18:33,540 --> 00:18:31,590 Hines I'm not a physicist but 443 00:18:35,900 --> 00:18:33,550 considering that consciousness 444 00:18:42,420 --> 00:18:35,910 apparently is not an epiphenomena brain 445 00:18:44,330 --> 00:18:42,430 going back to the the particle that was 446 00:18:46,830 --> 00:18:44,340 going to be there split or not split 447 00:18:48,150 --> 00:18:46,840 when it was measured in and the wave 448 00:18:50,310 --> 00:18:48,160 function being collapsed when it was 449 00:18:54,180 --> 00:18:50,320 measured is it really any less tenable 450 00:18:55,980 --> 00:18:54,190 to assume that the observation collapse 451 00:18:57,570 --> 00:18:55,990 the wave function and retro actively 452 00:19:00,540 --> 00:18:57,580 determine whether the particle is split 453 00:19:03,060 --> 00:19:00,550 or not than it is to assume that the 454 00:19:07,590 --> 00:19:03,070 particle determined what the operator 455 00:19:15,540 --> 00:19:07,600 was going to choose create previous to 456 00:19:18,120 --> 00:19:15,550 its being split or not split well in a 457 00:19:19,800 --> 00:19:18,130 way that that question like from the 458 00:19:22,050 --> 00:19:19,810 standpoint of quantum theory that 459 00:19:23,580 --> 00:19:22,060 question is meaningless the all the 460 00:19:24,720 --> 00:19:23,590 mathematical application standard 461 00:19:26,370 --> 00:19:24,730 interpretation is that all the 462 00:19:28,290 --> 00:19:26,380 mathematical apparatus doesn't refer to 463 00:19:30,090 --> 00:19:28,300 anything all you've got are the 464 00:19:31,920 --> 00:19:30,100 experiments and what the mathematical 465 00:19:33,180 --> 00:19:31,930 apparatus does it tells you what's going 466 00:19:36,180 --> 00:19:33,190 to happen at the time you'll actually 467 00:19:40,230 --> 00:19:36,190 make an observation so whatever happened 468 00:19:43,650 --> 00:19:40,240 there you know I mean first person was 469 00:19:45,570 --> 00:19:43,660 Bernie said Arnold particles so how is 470 00:19:47,280 --> 00:19:45,580 that particle making that decision so if 471 00:19:52,100 --> 00:19:47,290 the particle is making that decision and 472 00:19:55,080 --> 00:19:52,110 then informs the observer somehow it's 473 00:19:56,790 --> 00:19:55,090 possible I I suppose I mean I have to 474 00:20:05,490 --> 00:19:56,800 but afterwards I have to think about it 475 00:20:07,950 --> 00:20:05,500 but it just doesn't I'm sorry yeah we 476 00:20:09,530 --> 00:20:07,960 are out of time here so much as it would